[What follows is my somewhat stream of consciousness take on today's events. This post is a beast. Interested in your thoughts. And please point out where you think I've missed the mark. More will follow.]
The NAR has taken over certain technology assets of Cyberhomes from LPS (formerly known as FNRES) in order to bring its RPR (Realtors Property Resource) project, as well as its consumer-facing play, HouseLogic, to market. To do this, they have created Realtors Property Resource, LLC – a wholly owned subsidiary of the NAR.
Certain LPS executives, including Cyberhomes GM Marty Frame, will be making the transition over to NAR/RPR. Frame will serve as the President of the new entity. Dale Ross, who was co-founder of MRIS, the nation’s largest MLS, will be CEO. LPS will also provide call center support and other services as part of the deal.
The RPR database will contain parcel information on nearly 150 million properties through a data license from LPS, which (along with First American) is one of the two major sources of public property data.
This is interesting news, but let’s back up a minute for those of you who have more well rounded lives than I (my fellow online RE junkies can skip down to my take on what this deal means).
- The RPR is the national property database initiative that the NAR has been quietly working on for some time. It has gone by a number of names over the past couple years, including ”Gateway,” “The Real Estate Channel,” and the “Library/Archive.” It will aggregate tons of property data, including public records, in one place. This will be a Realtor-only database. The idea is to keep agents and brokers competitive amidst widespread data diffusion and other challenges.
- HouseLogic.com is a NAR-owned public destination site that will be unveiled next week at the NAR EXPO. The site is part of the NAR’s long-term strategy to engage consumers on behalf of its members.
- RIN is the “Realtors Information Network,” a for-profit arm of the NAR from which the RPR sprung. It was conceived for the purpose of creating an ill-fated online real estate service nearly 15 years ago. It was proprietary, something like a Prodigy or early AOL-type service. It blew up, costing the NAR millions. It was from that failure that the present-day Realtor.com was born, in 1996.
- The contract for developing the RPR was originally given to Move, Inc. back in late 2008. That obviously did not go so well.
- LPS is a new company created last summer at the tail end of a complicated corporate genealogy driven by Bill Foley, the visionary chairman of Fidelity National Financial. LPS was formerly known as FNRES and in June, 2009 announced a subsidiary, LPS Real Estate Group, to handle its real estate products: Paragon (MLS software), rDesk (agent and broker technology) and CyberHomes.
- Cyberhomes.com is a domain with a storied history in online real estate. It was launched by Moore Data, an MLS provider, back in the mid nineties and competed with Homeseekers.com, Microsoft HomeAdvisor and Homes.com. Moore sold the site (among other things) to VistaInfo in 1999, which in turn merged with Fidelity National Financial to create Fidelity National Information solutions (FNIS) in 2001. The cyberhomes.com domain ended up with Microsoft, which eventually shut down HomeAdvisor and relegated real estate to MSN Real Estate. FNRES, predecessor to LPS and spawn of FNF, took it from there and launched the new Cyberhomes in November of 2007.
And that’s just the quick and dirty. I’ve left out enough details to fill a McMansion. I’m not kidding.
A first take
The RPR is impressive. Enough data to choke a horse and a UI that is very well done. Foreclosure data. Default stats. Interactive charts. Even sliders for users to adjust the market conditions as they see them. On top of that, there is a basic community/social function. It’s extremely robust, perhaps to a fault.
An interesting facet to this is something the NAR/RPR team is calling the RVM – the “Realtor Valuation Model,” which they hope will become the “Gold Standard” (their words) for establishing a property’s fair market value.
What is not there now is MLS data, the hyperlocal secret sauce that will make the data array more than just a national-level combination of things already available somewhere else. The MLS goods are also key to making the RVM hit that Gold Standard.
Thumbs up or thumbs down?
For the NAR
Putting aside the question of whether or not the NAR should build a national property site (more on that below), this seems like a win for them. They get a talented team, a ton of data, and an infusion of tech mojo. Surely, there will be political blowback from within the ranks and the hand-to-hand combat involved in selling this to 900 MLSs (or – who knows – just going over their heads directly to brokers) will be bloody. But what has been done here is unprecedented: A serious move to lift property information above the broad plain of local silos.
Ultimately, I still think this is a defensive, almost quixotic move by the NAR, which seems to be wishing, once again, that Realtor value can be secured behind barricades and that a million + Realtors is a good thing.
But that’s just me. This is going to rattle a lot of cages. And that is good.
So thumbs up for the NAR.
For LPS
Cyberhomes has a lot going for it. A mainline to property data, some truly interesting products, and a number of initiatives that seemed to me to be at least directionally correct. But since the shift from FNRES to LPS, the energy just wasn’t there for a consumer-facing property. Bill Foley, the genius at the top, cut his last ties to the company in March. LPS is a B2B play, and a very good one at that. Cyberhomes was the fun guy that shows up to the board meeting in flip-flops. Whatever the terms of this deal, LPS has just unloaded what had become a somewhat incongruous part of its portfolio.
Oh, and they get a nice chunk of money from the NAR.
Thumbs up for LPS.
For brokers and agents
Brokers have been nudged out of pole position in the race for consumer engagement by a host of online players over the course of the past fifteen years. One more consumer destination, powered by their own trade association, isn’t going to hurt at this point. And to the extent that the RPR actually delivers on its promise to put unmatched property data at the fingertips of practitioners, this will be good thing … if it’s free.
Thumbs up for brokers and agents.
For Move
If I’m Move, I am thinking that I just saw my partner leverage one of my competitors (albeit a minor one) to go out and build a national destination site, part of which will be consumer facing. While the Realtor.com operating agreement remains intact, I cannot see how watching your biggest partner go the DIY route on something close to your goods is a positive thing.
Perhaps Move can partner with First American, the other (and actually more comprehensive) source of property data. Now that would be interesting.
Thumbs down for MOVE.
For MLSs
This is where it gets really thorny. As Brian Larson pointed out in his excellent post examining the potential business models for the RPR, there are lots of potential overlaps between a national property data site and what Realtors already get from their MLS. Some MLS operators think the NAR has no business doing this and perceive it as the precursor to a national MLS – a cataclysmic prospect from their perspective. Others – usually those who are relatively innovative and thus less insecure about their own value proposition – welcome the potential disruption.
Some will be convinced much as they were during the days of Homestore options and Gold Alliance dollars by the prospect of some upside. Others will be won over by NAR/RPRs insistence that there will be no offer of compensation in the RPR.
Whose ox gets gored, who benefits, and where the money flows is anybody’s guess at this point. But what I can safely say is that this is a significant shock to a system that needs it.
Will MLSs play ball? As with most things in this space, the outlook is unclear.
For online real estate
This jiggles the landscape a little. While this is largely a Realtor family matter, one must immediately think of the impact on Zillow. On the face of it, this seems like a move onto their turf. But it’s worth bearing in mind that Zillow’s (and indeed most of the major online players’) pitch to the industry is about delivering exposure. The RPR is about giving them data they can use in their business, and the public HomeLogic site … well, even though it’s looking very good, it’s going to be really hard for NAR/RPR, even with new talent, to be competitive with a Trulia or Zillow on things like SEO and PR. These guys have this stuff down; they get consumer experience. They have brains galore. It will be tough for NAR/RPR to be competitive.
HouseLogic will not compete with the big players for ad dollars – from either big consumer brands or agents and brokers. A “Find a Realtor” function will direct users to the agent directory that currently sits on Realtor.com. That’s it.
I do, however, see some fallout in the technology vendor community. The RPR has an immense amount of data and analytics – tables, charts, maps and more – some of which will be portable. Realtors can generate a variety of reports and print or email them. Some content from HouseLogic will be available to Realtors to use on their Websites, blogs and newsletters.
And having an industry foil to play against may actually help the online players.
Thumbs up for online real estate
For consumers
A site with lots of free property information? Realtors who have a more sophisticated set of tools at their disposal? These cannot be a bad things. But I am just a little uneasy when it comes to the potential revenue this project will derive from slicing and dicing the data in RPR and licensing it outside the industry. That’s a juicy opportunity. But without getting into the old debate about who owns a listing, I think it seems a little off that I can pay a Realtor 6% to sell my house then have that Realtor’s trade association make money off information about my transaction.
I think that’s best kept on the DL on the consumer side.
See you in San Diego
I can’t believe I just wrote 1,800 words. Thanks for hanging in there with me. There are many more angles on this, and they will no doubt be explored with great enthusiasm in San Diego next week. I’m looking forward to many interesting conversations.
It’s full steam ahead. To where only time will tell.
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[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Jason Sandquist and sedonakathy, Brian Boero. Brian Boero said: New on 1000watt Blog: #RPR Madness! NAR unleashes national property database with Cyberhomes http://bit.ly/4sUTP8 [...]
[...] I reserve the right to re-visit this post next year if NAR/RPR screw up. 2) More at 1000WattBlog. Related [...]
Where is realtor.com in this? Are they a competitor now?
Interesting! Can’t wait to read/hear more. See you at #nar09
[...] real estate industry. To be fair, NAR probably did not realize that it did so. Judging by the initial responses, it doesn’t appear to me that most people see what I saw. But, probably because of my [...]
So sick of monopolies. This is a terrible industry for any realtor to be involved in. No matter which way you slice it the number of realtors will be cut in half soon.
Quote “Thumbs down for Move” makes me smile!
Time will tell. I remain hopeful that this new site will help consumers without gouging NAR members, without whom this site would not exist.
I’m interested to see what this baby looks like and what it offers when they roll it out.
Glad Move is not involved.
I’m @SedonaKathy on Twitter and was delighted that you posted info about RPR which will formally be released at NAR 2009 in San Diego next week (11/11-16). Yesterday I understand that NAR held a Webinar for Leadership – a sneak preview. @DScherer will be a BOD member of the the new LLC. It is my understanding that REALTOR.com will not be a competitor, that RPR will complement REALTOR.com. My understanding is that it will more compete with Zillow and Trulia. The NAR people are not yet talking publically and won’t till the full unveiling in San Diego. I have been told to pay special attention to the HomeLogic portion of the new entity.
Another monopoly? Don’t know. Will have to see. It will be Jan or Feb before we begin to see anything and most will be large MLS BODs signing on…maybe some small ones… I have been a REALTOR(R) since 1985 and have dreamed of the day that we would have one national MLS. I was hoping at least for a statewide MLS, but the reality is that there are too many egos who want to control the data and too many Boards and Associations who remain financially dependant upon the fees they collect for MLS.
1. My head hurts
2. My opinion ..your best post ever.
3. Commercial Real Estate…data,mls Nar.future? thoughts?
As a Realtor – I look forward to a more complete – accurate data base with which to work from. I use listingbook and have purchased the upgraded premium service which allows me to put into my clients hands just about everything about a community surrounding their home, schools, market data – the whole works!
Many buyers feel that outside websites somehow offer better data because they are not associated with the MLS – truth told – they all have to pull data from somewhere. At the end of the day – all the Listing Info comes from the MLS.
NAR making a site – that runs completely independent of the MLS – is or is not a good idea – we shall wait and see.
More urgently,…..–>
Today in this market – legal or not – many listing agents tell Open House visitors (or any buyer) that they give better deals to people who do not have an agent represent them, or that they give lower prices to people who do not come in with an agent or that they will give them money back at the end of the deal. Or they just work hard to avoid offers from other agents or make it difficult – I am far more concerned with the huge amount of unethical agents out there – who lie to clients – give unethical advice – like to stop making payments on their home – and it seems nothing gets done,.. there are so many other issues that need addressed more urgently than a new data base of MLS from NAR.
I do wish that there was a better way to have listing agents give truthful and accurate information BOTH IN PERSON AND ON THE MLS)and that the dishonest agents ARE bummped out of the picture-entirely,..then a lot of this other stuff would take care of itself,..HUGE MLS NAR issues and all.
But as in every business venture – there has to be money to be made for someone. It will be interesting on how NAR resells this info, and who they sell it to – and to see how they work against their own members – and not with them.
If this happens – there is a good chance each state will need to re-address its rules and regulations regarding Real Estate – and that if NAR sells it’s self off to outside parties – then it would appear that it no longer can be trusted as looking out for the best interest of it’s members – which we all pay huge fees to be a member of.
It may filter out that – agents have to pay (again – another fee) to access this new website – to offer it up to its clients- as a 2nd source for NAR to make more money. Or other businesses will step in and offer programming that works with current MLS data and the new NAR national MLS combined to offer to agents an unsurpassed service to give to its clients and customers and friends. It all just makes the cost of being an Agent or a Realtor more and more expensive.
FYI a 6% commission you see on TV on a million $$ listing is not often happening for many – it is closer to a 1.5, 2 or 3% commission on a 250,000 home – that after a 60/40 split with the broker and the 30% for tax and the 3,000 for insurance and fees – the agent gets not even enough to pay for a 100 home advertisement mail-out.
all bs aside- i am ticked off that NAR would do this to agents. If they use my money to work against me – I am ticked off! That and you do not get MLS access without being a NAR member- this is looking more and more like a really screwed up money laundry game for NAR – screwed if you do,..and if you dont play their game you get screwed really bad. NAR gets to take all your money – and work against you – and then – they get to bill you again to use the service you already paid them to charge you to use?!! HUH!
G-rrrrrrr
Wow. I’m trying to wrap my brain around this. Thanks for the lengthy explanation, much appreciated. As an agent I am all for more, data, charts, maps etc. especially since now I’m pulling it all manually and it’s pain. Now I have hard time believing that it will be easy to get some MLS boards to come on board – unless there is some incentive, and then at what cost? I too fear that at the end of the day we the agents end up paying somehow, some way.
One other bigger issue I’m concerned about is that it comes down to how good the foundation is – of the data collected to begin with, there is certainly vast improvements to be made by some local MLSs in that arena. Meaning there is already so many complaints about how inaccurate Zillow or Trulia data is.
Now I have to think about this a little more.
Like the idea of having better data at hand for brokerages and agents. Not liking the possibility of this competing with brokerage websites, many of which can’t come close to matching the resources of NAR yet put a lot of money out there for their own sites. Our own MLS has a site that competes with brokerage and agent sites to capture visitors and sell them on Home & Garden and Vacation Rentals.
Excellent article. This is now one of the things that I’m most interested in learning about in San Diego! I think this helps take the industry one step closer to a property-centric approach like has been advocated by calREDD (the new “statewide” MLS for CA by CAR).
My biggest concern would be what they might charge for the data feed. From what I am reading, it appears free for real estate agents to use the platform but I didn’t read anywhere about the data feed being free.
I would have to imagine there will be a fee for this and if local MLSs get fazed out, the cost of the feed could be to high for the average real estate agent.
[...] RPR Madness! NAR unleashes national property database with Cyberhomes [...]
Nice job and I read all 1800 words. I was on the call. I think we will still need our MLS’s for many things, like getting data in the system. I might have missed something but the system needs to have a way to get data on listings and I don’t think they are building an interface for that.
say same thing I said over at Notorious R.O.B. – one thing missing in this mix, GOOGLE – thoughts?
http://maps.google.com/help/maps/realestate/data_provider_faq.html
“I think it seems a little off that I can pay a Realtor 6% to sell my house then have that Realtor’s trade association make money off information about my transaction.” NO. KIDDING.
I am so interested to see how this plays out. Based on some of the moves that NAR’s made in the past, it’s possible that this will amount to nothing more than a house of cards. BUT (and this is a big but) … this somehow FEELS different. I don’t know.
RPR’s in great hands with Dale. He certainly knows his stuff and has more than a little experience to back up his position there. I’m glad to see that all of the dues that REALTORS pay to NAR are actually being used for some real innovation. That said, IS it a win for them? I’m undecided.
For personal reasons, I’m paying very, VERY close attention to RPR and its potential implications. This has the potential to be truly game-changing.
Side notes: Giant bonus points to you for use of the term “quixotic”. Also, big ups for your now decidedly prescient post on the 4th. Is something big coming? Ya think?!?
[...] 1000 Watt Blog [...]
Great Post Brian and I read all 1800 words. It definitely seems to be a move to compete with the National Aggregators (Trulia, Zillow etc.). How does a Realtor benefit from a National database as most operate in a hyper local area? I didn’t get the impression that the MLS interaction will go away for the Realtor, although they would be concerned about RPR.
For a brokerage, I can see some benefit of consistent data. I work for a large regional brokerage with footprint in 9 MLS’s and they can benefit from consistency of property data across all 9 MLS’s if RPR could provide that. Too early to say. Finally, LPS (FNIS) has had a history of not integrating technology well, so am not sure if they will deliver here.
Well, when they finally do realize that a national MLS would make sense, we have a great domain for it:
USMLS.COM
KS
I agree with Ken Webb, above, who ended in GRRRRR!
I’m curious about the privacy aspect of the property and consumer data on RPR. Will this database of databases allow Realtors throughout the country to put together different bits of information from different proprietary databases in a way that might reveal specific information about individual homeowners? And if not now, perhaps in the future? That would be useful for Realtors, sure. But what about the homeowners’ privacy?
Brian – this is an amazing post. Having spent more than a year as an RPR Advisory Board member, I can tell you that there is a lot of information to absorb in San Diego this week. Everyone should get to at least of the RPR sessions and review the fact sheet. http://bit.ly/33pX9Y Watch for the press releases Monday, June 9 – Kevin
@Marcie
Thank you for bringing this up…the privacy question is big one and related to my uneasiness about the data derived from commission and fee generating transactions being reformulated and sold for profit. Legal? Yes. But smart? Not so sure.
@Kevin
Thanks for linking to the fact sheet. I think the mention of CAR and FAR there is going to raise its own set of questions.
[...] NAR and the MLSs. Brian Boero, from 1000Watt, doesn’t use such stark language, but he, too, thinks RPR will be a “a significant shock to a system that needs it” and asks: “Will MLSs play [...]
Thanks for your excellent blog on the new hook up of Cyberhomes and NAR. Breaking down the winners and losers was a great approach. A couple things come to mind about the continued march of technology/information proliferation in real estate:
1. What are the true goals/intentions behind the move?
2. Being at the tipping point with information everywhere will the agents that win be the ones who can interpret data the best, then anticipate what is next?
3. Who is a highly trasparent market best for? Seller, buyer, agent, broker, or the owner of the info???
One thing is for sure, the day of the agent that pushes buyers or sellers into bad deals, or does not know their market are numbered….
I feel uneasy about it. First of all, I think the addition of “home valuations” are silly in any database initiative because home values are open to a lot of interpretation. I would still do my own valuation of a home, simply because I trust myself to make this determination more than a national database.
If a profit is made from what was referred to as “commission/fee” generated transactions, I think that is unethical. Doesn’t NAR preach about holding a higher standard of ethics?
Lastly, if this information was ever to be made available to the public, I don’t care how wonderful of a Realtor you are, your visibility to potential buyers decreases. Let’s face it, most successful Realtors are successful because of that first opportunity they get to be in front of someone. Taking away my privilege as a licensed agent to have access to data that consumers do not currently have allows me that one shot to get in front of them when they need to know statistics. Remove that opportunity from me and you remove a portion of my lead generation. Unacceptable. Just my opinion.
Hi Brian,
Just a small point of clarification on your post, which I enjoyed reading. I’m the VP of Web Publishing for NAR and, as such, I’ve been very involved in the development of Houselogic. The web site isn’t the consumer-faceing portion of RPR, nor is it owned by RPR. I’ve seen it positioned that way in a few of the piece I’ve read about the Houslogic/RPR webcast on 11/6, so I thought I’d just jump in here to clarify.
NAR owns Houselogic, and the purpose of the site is to provide all the information a smart consumer needs to protect, maintain, and enhance the value of his or her home. The web site is NAR’s way of building a direct relationship with consumers on behalf of its members. Through the content at the web site, NAR is helping its members become a consumer’s trusted advisor throughout the lifecycle of homeownership.
The web site also makes it easy for homeowners to stay in touch with public policy issues that impact them as property owners and to weigh in to their lawmakers on those issues on which NAR and homeowners have a common interest.
Hope this is helpful.
[...] RPR Madness! NAR unleashes national property database with Cyberhomes – Let the debate begin. A national style MLS with more bells and whistles. The first two posts [...]
@Pamela
Thanks for the clarification!
An exceptional 1800 words, Brian. Nicely summarized and explained. Thank you.
[...] is the the RPR? Brian Boero from 1000Watt Blog sums it up nicely. The NAR has taken over certain technology assets of Cyberhomes from LPS [...]
Interesting. The odds of this thing going well or failing just conjure up too many scenarios to contemplate at the moment. One thing is certain – there will be a bunch of twists and turns and I imagine some ferocious fights along the way – if it does get serious.
They have not provided a compelling web experience in the past, and I somehow doubt that they are going to learn how to in the near future.
-Tyler
@Tyler,
You must not have seen the webcast
I noticed you called HouseLogic, “HomeLogic” in the “For online real estate” section of your article, might want to update? Historically, I wonder what the online real estate space would have been if the Realtor.com domain wasn’t owned by MOVE INC.
Weighing in here as a long time real estate association staff member. LOVED the article and thank you for all the great info, Brian. I, too, will be in San Diego and eagerly awaiting hearing all the details and opinions. My favorite point is made by Pamela. If this information, and the ensuing website, REALLY do educate the public about the homebuying and owning process, its a win-win for both the REALTORS AND the public. I have created six Housing Expo’s in the Bay Area for three different real estate association’s and THAT is the value all real estate Association’s can bring to the public. This announcement will undoubtedly affect the local AOR’s in some manner as many of our members tie the local AOR’s and the MLS’s together. Should be an interesting ride, that’s for sure!
The webinar that everyone is talking about can now be viewed here.
http://www.realtor.org/about_nar/stinton_webinar_110609
I promise it’s not a RickRoll.
I am so happy that you are willing to track and post on stuff like this. I am having a hard time keeping it all straight.
Aloha,
Keahi
Awesome post, but it will take some google type moves to really shake things up. Can’t wait to see what happens next…
Great post Brian but I am left with a few questions..
1. NAR are spending just $12m to create a better Zillow/Trulia on a 10x scale? Possible yes, Probable no.
2. NAR want to hide data from the consumer and at the same time motivate the consumer to lobby for real estate action?
3. NAR with all its layers of authority expect to out innovate the rest of the industry. I doubt Move, Zillow, Trulia etc will simply sit idle and wait for NAR to catch up?
4. Are MLS’s really going to be motivated to help this action?
5. Was this really the BEST course of action for NAR to help it’s members over the next decade or was it the best course of action to help NAR regain control of its industry.
Either way, good on NAR for taking some action. Change is good.
Change is good and I like to see
Great post Brian but I am left with a few questions..
1. NAR are spending just $12m to create a better Zillow/Trulia on a 10x scale? Possible yes, Probable no.
2. NAR want to hide data from the consumer and at the same time motivate the consumer to lobby for real estate action?
3. NAR with all its layers of authority expect to out innovate the rest of the industry. I doubt Move, Zillow, Trulia etc will simply sit idle and wait for NAR to catch up?
4. Are MLS’s really going to be motivated to help this action?
5. Was this really the BEST course of action for NAR to help it’s members over the next decade or was it the best course of action to help NAR regain control of its industry.
Either way, good on NAR for taking some action. Change is good.
I think as a leader and a credible source for real estate information this is both a brilliant and necessary move for Realtor.com. However I question its place in overall landscape. Where does Joe Agents personal marketing benefit from this. Are we able to pay to get the feed for our clients use as a widget or as a programmable API?
I don’t blame NAR for trying to help agents compete with Zillow, Trulia and others, but this seems like one more example of the Realtor community trying to protect The Realtor, rather than serve the consumer. Like newspapers, they need to look at the immutable laws of the relentless Internet: consumers will eventually get the information they want and no wall can be built high enough to stop this from happening.
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[...] of posts about the validity and impact of RPR on the real estate industy, two of my favorites are Brian Boero and Rob Hahn. Go read those, now. And don’t forget the comments [...]
[...] kids on the block. Will it work? Maybe. Who does it benefit? See this awesome article on 1000 Watt Consulting for an in-depth [...]
Would it be safe to say this is a normal strategy for NAR to persue in dealing with the rapid success (meaning marketshare) other R.E. startups have been eating away at? Anyone remember the Netscape-Microsoft war? We’ve seen this knee-jerk before in other industries and only signals the real deterioration that is taking place inside NAR. They should have been the “real” innovators leading the way in the industry all along. NAR can’t afford to sit idle any longer. Looks like one of many disruptions to come.